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Joining in Scholarly Discourse:
What Do You Say After You Say "Hello"?

California State University, Dominguez Hills
University of Wisconsin, Parkside
Latest update: January 12, 1999
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What Do You Say After You Say "Hello"?
Aesthetics on Dear Habermas?
One way to join an academic discourse is to ask
a question to which you want the answer.

Developing Ideas: Process Texts in the Making
Notes on how we are organizing the site to permit
easier development of process texts and making sure
that collaboration works for all of us.
Academic Discourse Jump Right In Making Forum Work Participate
Current Texts Progress Reports for Ongoing Projects

Holding Pattern Files interrupted because of time constraints.
Nag if I don't get back to them. jeanne
Links We Plan to Integrate into Site Sections on DH

Basic Concepts
Concepts you need to be aware of to take an active role in this discourse.
This file is under construction - not yet finished.
Link on DH HomePage is through the Support line on navigation table.
Feedback Comments to Help You in Scholarly Discourse



Developing Ideas: Process Texts in The Making

Essay by Jeanne Curran and Susan R. Takata

Quick Notes is the mechanism we have developed to handle the problem of academic discourse on the site. It's a new mechnism in January 1999, and it will undoubtedly develop its own narrative and take its own course. This essay deals with its origins.


Academic Discourse on the Site

This section comes in response to the barriers we have encountered in the actual process of creating academic discourse on the site. Academic discourse is the dialogue in which colleagues participate in the creation of new knowledge and understanding. It is not traditional teaching dialogue. To participate, one must already be familiar with the basic concepts on which the dialogue is based, or bring related kinds of concepts from other field and/or experiences.

Academic discourse is a privileged activity traditionally open only to those who had enough time (ususally within their work environment) and the privilege of belonging to an environment that could afford such leisure. That is, academic discourse was elitist. The ivory tower. Elitist not only through the knowledge-base requisite to significant participation, but elitist also in simple access to the forum.

This elitism was so real that when the budget crises in funding research in higher education hit even institutions like Stanford, there began to be noticeable differences in even doctoral programs. Researchers at Stanford found in the '80s that there was measurable difference in the amount of time that Ph.D. students got to spend with the leading professors in their departments. At the elite and well-funded schools, doctoral candidates were expected, as part of their training, to participate in academic discourse with their professors. At the second-tier schools, as decreasing funds made it more difficult to run the research labs, doctoral students found themselves taking over the technical tasks of directing and managing the labs. There was no longer time for academic discourse. This was reflected in the jobs offered the school's graduates. Graduates of elite institutions were trained for and offered rare professorships that permitted them to move into the next generation of professional leaders. Graduates of the second-tier institutions received more "training" and were more likely to move professionally into "directing and managing research labs." (This study was presented at a Queen's College meeting on Social Class and Higher Education in the late '80s, early '90s.)

Such elitism runs counter to the legitimacy that some of us still seek in public discourse. Since Dear Habermas is a forum dedicated to developing the skills of public discourse, and providing accessible forums, elitist academic discourse is inappropriate to the Dear Habermas site. Quick Notes is our first formal attempt to see that we keep academic discourse open to all, provide entry points, and move toward educating, not "training" our students.

For more information on our approach to academic discourse, consult Pierre Bourdieu, Jean-Claude Passeron, and Monique de Saint Martin, Academic Discourse: Linguistic Misunderstanding and Professorial Power, Stanford University Press, 1965. Bourdieu et al. say:

"Indeed, the professor is as resigned to his students and their 'natural' incapacities as the 'good colonist' is to the 'ntives', for whom he has no higher expectations than that they be just the way they are" (At p. 7)


Students, It's OK, Jump Right In

It's usually scary the first time you're invited into someone's backstage. Scary for you that you might not know how to behave, not know the norms. Scary for them that you might prove an unwanted guest. Security is one of the reasons cliques develop. Quick Notes provides two ways to offer security to all who wish to take part in academic discourse on this site.

  • Lurking is possible.

    By all means visit Quick Notes, see what's happening. Remember the sociological studies that say that leadership can be shown by asking sincere questions, to which you really want an answer. Lurk and ask questions.

  • Express how you feel about the issue.

    To participate effectively, you can also express what you're feeling, and add the caveat that you don't have a theoretical argument to defend that feeling. Chances are that one of the faculty on the site will, and will supply that for you.

    There is almost no position you can take that we do not know of some supporting evidence. There are many perspectives to every issue. It's part of our job to know them all as best we can. By forcing us to consider them, you keep us thinking reflexively. So by all means, challenge, politely. This is part of your professional socialization, and an important part of our job.

  • Quick Notes maintains editing control.

    This is not a "free post" site. Submissions must be e-mailed. That means that discussions can't get rowdy. So good manners will be observed.


Establishing An Accessible Forum and Making It Work

The problem we've had with establishing access to the forum is the difficulty of keeping up during very busy times with the patterns of thought we're each developing. Faculty, students, and community are not used to such intensive and basic sharing of scholarly arguments. Yet, all that we know about reflexive learning and reflexive theory requires such sharing, if the result is to lead us to public discourse.

  • Unstated Assumption: Everybody Knows What I'm Thinking About

    We have often assumed that others were not interested in creating the texts because no indications of such interest were forthcoming. The wicked little unstated assumption there is that others will know of the exciting ideas we're thinking of. After all, they know us and are actively working with us.

  • Need for Statement of the Assumption and Sharing in the Development of Ideas

    When we're exploring critical theory and establishing a community as quickly as we seem to be doing, many ideas remain only partially articulated. We are assuming that our colleagues and students are privy to the out-of-awareness processing we are doing with every bit of new information that fits that text we're thinking of . Apperceptive masses are too individualized for that to be so. We need to share in the processing of ideas within multiple perspectives. And our students and community colleagues need to know where entry points into our thinking exist.

  • The Quick Notes as A First Stage Process in the Creation of Texts

    We are creating this Quick Notes as a forum for all those who are interested in the ideas that are being generated. Postings should be sent to this site when as part of the reflexive process:

    • We want to share the connections we are making with other perspectivees.
    • There are connections we have made but there hasn't been time to write full descriptions of how we came to those connections (linking other theories and resources) and how those connections link to public discourse. Exposing them here allows others to see the cognitive paths we are following and to join us.
    • We want to establish entry points to sharing in our work.
    • We recognize the need for the kind of shared academic dialogue that modern commuter education doesn't leave us the time for.


    Participate

    Faculty on the Site or jeanne at jcurran@csudh.edu.
    Put in Subject line of message: quick notes


Quick Notes: Current Texts
(So We Won't Forget and So You Will Know What We're Working On)

  • Subject: Market Fundamentalism

    Soros and the issue of market fundamentalism in NY Book Review - link it to Fat and Mean - David M. Gordon

  • Subject: Girls and Learning

    Egypt - the fundamentalist girls -

    separate schools - Egyptian minister says educate one girl, educate ten people NY Times, January 5, 199 p. A8. p. 79 in girls gangs and juvy: same quote


      Progress on Ongoing Projects for Process Texts

      We'll put up progress stages for each of these shortly. jeanne

      Retention Study

      Shared papers for Fort Worth

      Critical Criminoloty Paper - Fort Worth

      Moot Court Paper - Atlanta

      Learning as Narrative Identity